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Hannah Fidell, left, Liz Garcia, Cherien Dabis, Naomi Foner and Gabriela Cowperthwaite. (Jay L. Clendenin / Los Angeles Times / January 22, 2013) |
Garcia: Yeah. And that's, like, okay. You know, there are a lot of films that I don't get, because they don't mean anything to me, 'cause they're about men. And in fact, they might actively annoy me. Because this is a male vision that—maybe this is an aspect of the male personality that I find harder to deal with. And that's okay. I mean, I remember, you know, when I was in film school and we were studying Scorsese. He was a big part of my senior year at Wesleyan. And we would talk about how he feels about women. And at a certain point it's like, "Okay, it's fine. He's just not interested in women. He's interested in the world of men. That's great. I'm interested in the world of women." There's room for all of us, right?
FULL COVERAGE: Sundance Film Festival 2013
I remember early in his career, John Singleton tried to have all-black crews on his films. It was very hard. Because there weren't department heads that he could pick from. When you are putting together your crews, and say it's equal—for sound department there's a man and a woman, totally equal skill set—will you put a finger on the scale of the woman? In other words, will you try to actively find women and surround yourself with women on your crew and try to promote other women, so that you can kinda create some kinda groundswell of women who are working in the business?
Foner:I had an experience when I worked at the Children's Television Workshop, where there was an open job for some executive that they wanted to fill with a black American. And they hired somebody, who was completely unqualified. And it was to me the worst kind of racism. And in the end, the person failed, and the job had to be replaced with somebody else. I think hiring people just because they're anything is a mistake. I think when I find qualified, great women—this room is filled with such amazing women; I mean, just the conversation level is so extraordinary—yes.
Right. I said they were equally competent. I said finger on the scale. That was my question. That you weren't gonna hire somebody who was lame.
Foner:Absolutely. And the reason absolutely is because there's so few women in most possible job categories
Gabriela?
Cowperthwaite: I completely agree. I was just thinking as you were asking that question. 'Cause I was like, "Well, of course." It's equal, and you know, if a woman has ambition. Especially I'm thinking camera, which is so clutch for documentary. It's embarrassing to admit, but I was just thinking to myself, you know, there's so much lugging for cinematography for a documentary. You just don't have a crew. You don't have a crew. So it's really her and maybe at best an AC [assistant camera], but that AC has enough to do on their own. So we're just going—
Just the physical requirements of the job are—
Cowperthwaite: to Iraq where we're Marines. It's horrendous. And it's like, "Oh, great. There's already me." You know? Now all of a sudden I have—it's not that I don't think that she can carry stuff, but I'm just like, when push comes to shove and the [crap] hits the fan, can I be like, "You know, can you go do that? Just go do it"? Just for a second there I was like—I speak to women differently. I tend to speak more softly. I don't want to offend. You know, I'm more cautious about how I speak to them because I imagine they're gonna be more sensitive. Whereas with a guy I could be like, "Wow, wow, wow, we gotta go. We gotta go." You know? And I don't know. And it just occurred to me that that was going through my head. Now if she were a great cinematographer, it wouldn't matter. I'm just saying that thought would come into my mind.
Dabis: That you take those things into consideration.
Cowperthwaite: Correct. Not in terms of making the decision, but it would just enter my mind. Whereas with a big burly guy, I'm like, "He's gonna carry everything. He's gonna be fine if we're ten degrees below zero." Is that strange?
Foner: As a woman, I think I'd be likely to say—I would actually say out loud what was making me hesitate. I feel like—
You'd be more candid.
Foner:I'd be more candid. I would say—
Cowperthwaite: "You're gonna have to carry. This is gonna be—are you okay with that?" That's a good solution. But, yeah. I've never not hired a woman because of that, but wow. The fact that it enters my head is making me uncomfortable.
Cherien?
Dabis:Part of what you touched on and part of what I sort of really picked up on in what you were saying is I feel like I strive for a certain level of balance. One of the things that you said was, you know, you're already a woman. And so is there a perspective that can be brought to the table that could add something that you're making not seeing as a woman? And that's, I think, something that I sometimes think about in various roles. So it's not just about someone being as competent. I think it's about what perspective they bring, what the particular project is and the requirements of the project, and a number of just those types of factors.
Foner: don't think I'd want an all-woman crew.
Dabis:Yeah. I don't know that I would. I think also it's really about how you connect with someone. You know? So that's so important. You're really in the trenches with these people. And sometimes you connect more with a man. You never know.
